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Freedom Collection

Interviews with Mamphela Ramphele

Interviewed May 20, 2024

I think it was a journey, which if you look historically, 1976 really marked a complete different phase of the level of resistance. People whose minds were freed were not going to go back into the box. So after the Soweto uprisings we had mass, mass mobilization in the churches, on the factory floors, in the universities, in the streets with civic organizations and so on. So it was a mounting momentum, which made it very clear that there is not going to be sustainability of a government that represents a minority.

[Soweto, meaning Southwest Township, was a community near Johannesburg designated for black residents. Under apartheid, townships were residential areas designated for non-white groups. Non-whites were prohibited from living in areas reserved for whites. The Soweto Uprising was a series of protests led by South African high school students on June 16, 1976. Students from various Sowetan schools began demonstrating in the streets against Afrikaans as the primary language of educational instruction.]

It is also the case that I was fortunate in 1988 to be invited by Mr. [Nelson] Mandela to meet him at Pollsmoor Prison because of his tentative moves to start the negotiations. They had moved them from Robben Island to Pollsmoor Prison.

[Nelson Mandela (1918 – 2013) was a South African anti-apartheid revolutionary and politician who served as the first post-apartheid President of South Africa from 1994-1999. Robben Island, now a museum, was the site of a maximum security prison where Nelson Mandela and other political prisoners were jailed. Pollsmoor is a maximum security prison near Cape Town. During the apartheid era, both common and political criminals were held there.]

He invited me to come and meet him. Now you can imagine, this man had just been a historic figure, I´d never met him. I had no idea what he looked like. The pictures that we had were completely different from the person now late in his years. He was in his seventies. But also I didn´t understand why he would want to talk to me. I wasn´t a member of the ANC [African National Congress], either underground or above ground.

And it was a meeting which really changed my life in the sense of really getting to know the underbelly of the processes that were nascent and as they strengthened, I was privy to the discussions through Mr. Mandela. And why did he want to see me? Because he had been exposed to activists of the Black Consciousness Movement, people like Saths Cooper and Mosiuoa Lekota and many others who ended up on Robben Island. Mosiuoa was not but there were other people who were in the Black Consciousness Movement who ended up there. Mosiuoa was one of those who had detained here on South African soil.

And so he got fascinated by the Black Consciousness Movement. He read about Steve Biko. He wanted to meet me because he wanted to understand the thinking of the time and the motivation, but I think he also was aware that when change comes South Africa is going to need all the talents to come together regardless of political affiliation to build the country that we want to be part of. And so that was the beginning of a friendship, a father-daughter relationship that lasted until his passing last year.

[The African National Congress (ANC) is a political party that served as the most prominent resistance movement against South Africa’s apartheid system, at times resorting to violence through its military wing, Umkhonto we Sizwe. It was officially banned by the South African government from 1960 to 1990. As apartheid collapsed, the ANC’s leader, Nelson Mandela, was elected President of South Africa in 1994 and established a democratic government. Dr. Saths Cooper (1950 – ) is a South African of Indian dissent. He was an anti-apartheid activist and political prisoner. Mosiuoa Lekota (1948 – ) is a South African politician who served as the Minister of Defense from 1999 to 2008. He was an anti-apartheid activist and political prisoner. Stephen Bantu Biko (1946 – 1977) was an anti-apartheid activist and the leader of South Africa’s Black Consciousness Movement. He died in 1977, from injuries sustained while in police custody.